When a 3.11.55 Gold game has been banged using the maximum settings for Bubble size, 199 sectors, can any of the current Helpers or Scripts correctly find and map these mongo-size bubbles? Using ZOC with The Reverend's PMAP2A program, the bubble list shows a lot of tunnels that are actually part of larger bubbles, but is incorrectly showing the "gate" sectors. PMAP2A doesn't seem to have been designed for really big bubbles. Anyone know of an offline SECTOR.DAT analysis program that can accurately map out or list out even really huge bubbles and correctly identify the common gate sector? I'd try to write something myself but I'm not enough of a programmer to write code for this kind of analysis.

TradeWars Assistant TWASSIST.EXE can map such bubbles, showing the door and listing all sectors in the bubble. It has two failings, it cannot handle more than 5K sectors and it will not recognise a bubble that has a one-way exit.
It is an offline database, strictly speaking not a "real" helper, but if you use a terminal program such as ZOC,Qmodem,Telix or whatever you can use twassist automode to interrogate the database while playing.

quote:Originally posted by lcharlot

When a 3.11.55 Gold game has been banged using the maximum settings for Bubble size, 199 sectors, can any of the current Helpers or Scripts correctly find and map these mongo-size bubbles? Using ZOC with The Reverend's PMAP2A program, the bubble list shows a lot of tunnels that are actually part of larger bubbles, but is incorrectly showing the "gate" sectors. PMAP2A doesn't seem to have been designed for really big bubbles. Anyone know of an offline SECTOR.DAT analysis program that can accurately map out or list out even really huge bubbles and correctly identify the common gate sector? I'd try to write something myself but I'm not enough of a programmer to write code for this kind of analysis.

J-Twat can analyze a CIM style warp list for large bubbles and give you fairly accurate results.

Swath does the Same

quote:Originally posted by Overkill

Swath does the Same

Swath will not allow you to input raw warp data, so it's pretty much impossible to use it to do analysis of a game unless you use it's built in ztm or have enough explored that you don't need to ztm.

SWATH misses some of the bubbles. If you use its ZTM feature you can then use its bubble finding feature and SOMETIMES find large bubbles. SWATH's ZTM does not produce a 100% accurate map, however---that can only be done by exploration.

I've often wondered why a script or function couldn't be written that simply does a C-I-sector # and gets the warp-connects from each sector, then builds a map on that. Such a map would be 100% accurate and would only require one query per sector, but it couldn't be done from CIM mode--it'd have to be done from the C-I screen. I'd imagine that the logistics of writing the alogrithm to construct the map of the information might be tough. I'll ask on the SWATH site.

quote:Originally posted by midnight

SWATH misses some of the bubbles. If you use its ZTM feature you can then use its bubble finding feature and SOMETIMES find large bubbles. SWATH's ZTM does not produce a 100% accurate map, however---that can only be done by exploration.

I've often wondered why a script or function couldn't be written that simply does a C-I-sector # and gets the warp-connects from each sector, then builds a map on that. Such a map would be 100% accurate and would only require one query per sector, but it couldn't be done from CIM mode--it'd have to be done from the C-I screen. I'd imagine that the logistics of writing the alogrithm to construct the map of the information might be tough. I'll ask on the SWATH site.

You can only do a C-I on a sector you have already viewed. Pressing ^-I gives you the exact same information only all at once. The first number is the sector number, the 2nd - 7th are the warps out. Either way, it is only useful once you have explored the sector.

Well i do use the ZTM with swath but also use the TWX proxy ZTM which you can import into swath... Swath is the best mapper i have found out there. And yes if you know how to use swath you can do analysis of a game if you know what you are doing in swath. I use swath for mapping and Zoc and Twx for my scripting. If swath was alittle bit faster in the scripting area i would use it more for it. You can enable the java on it and the scripts when it's enable are faster. Some people have wrote scripts for swath and the are superior then the TWX scritps i have seen. Don't knock swath down cause you don't know how to use it.[;)]

I'm not sure what I was thinking when I wrote the part about using ZTM. I suppose that one could ZTM, send eprobes out to most of the far-away dead ends, and get a decent map that way

I've heard that the pack 1 ZTM mapper in TWX is 100% accurate, albeit slow. How would one import the map into SWATH, or the pack 2 ZTM mapper for that matter?

quote:Originally posted by midnight

I'm not sure what I was thinking when I wrote the part about using ZTM. I suppose that one could ZTM, send eprobes out to most of the far-away dead ends, and get a decent map that way

I've heard that the pack 1 ZTM mapper in TWX is 100% accurate, albeit slow. How would one import the map into SWATH, or the pack 2 ZTM mapper for that matter?

The pack 1 mapper with twx is only 99.99% accurate and takes me about 6 hours on a dialup connection. It will miss 2 or 3 warps in a 5k sector game. However, for the most part, these warps really don't matter much. It is possible to get that degree of accuracy in about an hour, but I have been sworn to secrecy on that matter, so I can't explain how. As to importing into swath, I'm curious on this also. I asked macahan at one point and he said it was not possible to import a raw warp list into swath.

heh, you can actually import a raw warp list into swath if you're prepared to put up a fight. Basically, connect swath to a shell account, change your command prompt to match a tradewars command prompt, tell swath to run a CIM load, and then cat the file.

Its very fiddly, but when you really "need" to....

Other option btw is to load the warp file into Attac, then export as .twx then load into swath.

Dr. Bad


quote:Originally posted by Kemper_3

quote:Originally posted by midnight

I'm not sure what I was thinking when I wrote the part about using ZTM. I suppose that one could ZTM, send eprobes out to most of the far-away dead ends, and get a decent map that way

I've heard that the pack 1 ZTM mapper in TWX is 100% accurate, albeit slow. How would one import the map into SWATH, or the pack 2 ZTM mapper for that matter?

The pack 1 mapper with twx is only 99.99% accurate and takes me about 6 hours on a dialup connection. It will miss 2 or 3 warps in a 5k sector game. However, for the most part, these warps really don't matter much. It is possible to get that degree of accuracy in about an hour, but I have been sworn to secrecy on that matter, so I can't explain how. As to importing into swath, I'm curious on this also. I asked macahan at one point and he said it was not possible to import a raw warp list into swath.

Why dont you just load the file the flat text cim file into ATTAC. have a CIM file in format below and then run the bubble finder. finds bubbles just as well as swath.
earth.

:
sectors
:
ports
: END INTEROGATION

quote:Originally posted by earth

Why dont you just load the file the flat text cim file into ATTAC. have a CIM file in format below and then run the bubble finder. finds bubbles just as well as swath.
earth.

:
sectors
:
ports
: END INTEROGATION

I haven't had a chance to win a free copy of attac, so I've never really used it